Counter steering

[pete_falcone]

"****, look at that squid."

"Huh? Looks like a cow to me."

[kfsrq]

Originally Posted by pete_falcone

What if you have a bike that steers heavy?

That is naturally how a YaMOOha steers.

I always have sympathy for the poor motorcycle when I see pictures like this. When Johnny Carson first interviewed Evel Knievel, he imagined the motorcycle becoming aware of Evel's approach and thinking, "Here comes Evel ... YUUUCCHHH!"

Back on topic, I can tell you that, after fifty years in the saddle, I cannot say I steer as I should. If I suddenly catch sight of an obstacle ahead, and I surely should veer right to avoid it, my natural inclination is to turn the handlebar to the right ... just the wrong thing to do. I do not actually DO this, but I think there is a bit of delay before I push the right end of the handlebar forward. I keep on riding and learning.

I am learning that my new CBR-250R is a very fine bike indeed, and recently I learned that riding soon after surgery is a fine way to learn how rotten the roads are here in Toronto Canada. Every bump sent me a message, so the ride was short. But today I will ride again.

Keith

[EmptySet]

This is a good topic but I'm not sure it should be in the "Introductions" section. On other forums, there are Riding Skills sections to talk about these things but I don't see one here. It should still be moved.

On topic: I try not to discuss counter-steering in detail with new riders. They have enough to learn that it might end up confusing them even more. The term "counter-steering" also doesn't help matters since it implies that you're doing something opposite of turning when in fact it's it is just a small part of the turning process.

At speed, even as low as 10 mph, bikes turn by leaning in the direction of the turn. To initiate the LEAN (not the turn), you use the counter-steering technique of pushing the handlebar in the opposite direction. Good ol' physics cause the bike to lean and initiate the TURN. Once leaned and in the turn, the handlebar will want to turn more in the same direction so you keep pressure in the opposite direction to balance the front wheel, keeping it relatively straight.

To do a right turn:
1. Flick the handlebar left (counter-steer), happens instinctively and quickly.
2. Bike will lean right and begin to turn right
3. Keep pushing on right grip to hold front wheel straight while in lean
4. Straighten up out of turn.

Once comfortable on the bike, it's easy to see this happen. In a parking lot, go straight at about 15 mph, flick the the handlebar left and right and see which direction the bike wants to lean.

[GoBigRed]

As a re-entry rider, I also found it necessary to remind myself to look toward the end of the curve, where I am heading, instead of right in front of me. This helped me a lotto make the whole turning process much more natural.

[ecustu7]

I think this should be discussed in the MSF class. I think it could help reduce some early accidents that young riders have. I think if I would have understood this concept better I would not have dumped my bike early on. Yes it takes time to understand and implement all the techniques required but thats why they should be introduced as soon as possible.

I have logged about 11,000 miles in about a year and a half and now I feel like Im really starting to understand this whole riding thing. The longer you ride and the more you learn, the more you realize you don't know, its that way with everything.

Great topic. A must read for all new riders.

[sendler]

Countersteering was discussed in my daughter's MSF training class and practiced in an avoidance maneuver drill. But it is hard to practice and experience at the slow speeds that are used in class. It is much more obvious at highway speed. You can practice until it is second nature by pushing on one bar and then the other to switch back and forth from the left track to the right and back again.

[northernlights]

I just think of it by "lift one handle bar, push the other one down".

[sendler]

It's not really lifting or pushing down. It's just pushing or pulling one hand straight forward or back briefly to make the bike lean so it can then turn. The important thing to learn is that it works the opposite of steering a car or a quadrunner which is what gets people into trouble in a panic situation.

[ecustu7]

Yes, it is taught for avoidance and I think pushing in or through the corner is taught, but its not taught or explained as much as it should be in the beginning MSF class.