nice looking rides.
side by side the ninja looks more aerodynamic
with the lower diving front,looks like it would
cut through the wind better at high speed.
I don't want to jump to conclusions on the first day but here are some impressions. I rode the Honda 180 miles. Rode the Ninja through town to pick up the Chinese food. But I have been out on it for hours over the last few weekends as it finally quit raining every day. They are very different in the engine but both are fast enough for freeway travel up to 80 where the Ninja will pull away and wave goodbye. The Honda is much roomier around the knees for taller riders but the stylists have over stepped their bounds with the body work. Better to let the aerodynamic engineers lead the design. It is much noisier. The Kawi with a Zero Gravity Sport Touring windscreen will really spoil you. They should call their company Zero Windnoise. Maybe ZG can step in to improve the Honda. I am wondering though if any of the noise comes from the bikini nose at the side panels. This will be harder to deal with if that is the case. The red/ silver is beautiful in real life. Pictures don't do it justice. All my friends that I visited today catagorically agree that the Honda is much better looking Than the Kawi which is more "all buisness". The tanks of both bikes are comfortable to lay down on and upright riding is comfortable too.
I hope the fuel economy of the CBR will improve with more miles. The first tank only went 134 miles and 2.2 gallons for 60.1 mpg. Ridden full tuck. That does include some rpm cycling up and down from 8,000 to 6,000. Gassing it and winding back down for break in.
Both bikes are good in fast sweepers. The Honda is a little easier to change lines. The front is a little soft but still carves accurately and the over all comfort of the ride quality is very nice over broken pavement. Less jolt than the Honda fit that I rode down in. Cross winds are no problem at 70mph when tucked. I felt that the bike actually tended to turn into the wind somehow. The big ZG screen on the Ninja throws a bubble that the winds can use to move the bike to the side more. Or, the front of the Kawasaki got lighter with the bigger screen. It is more easily moved around by wind now but the quietness is worth it. I hope to get the CBR to this level even if I have to diy a windscreen.
Fuel injection is a big step up during cold start. It was 85*F today and the Ninja still needs a couple minutes of warm up before it will take any throttle even though I have adjusted the idle mixture. The Honda's engine felt slow for the first five minutes. Break in? or maybe the fuel injection computer needed to learn for the first time after the O2 sensor came on line so it could start building a map.
The Honda shifts much better. First gear is not as low people say. Speed at redline is somewhere around 24mph? although I usually shift right out of first at 10. 66mph is exactly 7000 so this rpm is a bit higher than other youtubes I have watched showing standing start to top speed pulls of the tach and speedo. Possibly because my odometer reads 1% LOWER than actual. Very rare in the bike world. I haven't verified the Ninja yet but it seems to be way off by almost 10% fast.
The Honda doesn't lug better at 3000 even though the torque curves show that it should. The single piston has a chugging feel when it lugs whereas the Ninja doesn't really buck as much but it just doesn't pull. The rear brake of the CBR is very weak but I don't use the rear much anyway. The front feels good on both bikes. There is zero vibration in the seat of the Honda. Very little in the pegs and the left grip is also almost dead. The throttle hand buzzes some but every rider will have some pain in the right hand on any bike unless it is equiped with some sort of throttle holding aid.
I really like the front running lights in the CBR and the fact that the front turn signals also stay lit up low for running lights. This always catches my attention more when I see a big touring bike come at me with four lights in the front. Maybe oncoming cars will quit turning left right in front of me. Perfect weather today. I rode off and on all day and into the evening to get a quick look at the lights. The Ninja's low beam is terrible. Should be illegal to put something like that on the road. I found a way to tip the high beam bulb back by bending one tab which lowers the vertical cut off so that bike's lights are more like two low beams now. Much better and I can leave the high beam on most of the time even if there is a car up the road in front of me. Shining the lights on a wall side by side, maybe the Honda is better? I didn't take it back out after dark as I was on the Ninja for that trip but I will.
More comments later I'm sure.
Drivetrain lash is much worse with the Honda CBR250R even though the chain is a bit on the tight side of the spec. I wonder if there is a way to improve this. Around town, the torque advantage of the Honda makes it nicer than the Ninja 250R and I also feel that the ergonomics are better. There seems to be more leverage in the handle bars with the Honda and your head height is higher for better vision down the road even though the spec for the seat height is the same, I think the CBR sits a little higher. It looks and feels like a bigger bike. Except when it comes to turning or dodging pot holes, The Honda is quicker handling. And the ride is a little more plush. Same exact tires. Strangely enough, my 6'1" brother said he like his position on the Ninja better even though he was wishing for lower pegs to make room for his knees under the tank flair. My knod would go to the Honda around townbut the ZG screen on the Kawasaki is fantastic on the highway if you want to tuck.
.
CBR rear brake pads are very weak.
.
I don't want to jump to conclusions on the first day but here are some impressions. I rode the Honda 180 miles. Rode the Ninja through town to pick up the Chinese food. But I have been out on it for hours over the last few weekends as it finally quit raining every day. They are very different in the engine but both are fast enough for freeway travel up to 80 where the Ninja will pull away and wave goodbye. The Honda is much roomier around the knees for taller riders but the stylists have over stepped their bounds with the body work. Better to let the aerodynamic engineers lead the design. It is much noisier. The Kawi with a Zero Gravity Sport Touring windscreen will really spoil you. They should call their company Zero Windnoise. Maybe ZG can step in to improve the Honda. I am wondering though if any of the noise comes from the bikini nose at the side panels. This will be harder to deal with if that is the case. The red/ silver is beautiful in real life. Pictures don't do it justice. All my friends that I visited today catagorically agree that the Honda is much better looking Than the Kawi which is more "all buisness". The tanks of both bikes are comfortable to lay down on and upright riding is comfortable too.
I hope the fuel economy of the CBR will improve with more miles. The first tank only went 134 miles and 2.2 gallons for 60.1 mpg. Ridden full tuck. That does include some rpm cycling up and down from 8,000 to 6,000. Gassing it and winding back down for break in.
Both bikes are good in fast sweepers. The Honda is a little easier to change lines. The front is a little soft but still carves accurately and the over all comfort of the ride quality is very nice over broken pavement. Less jolt than the Honda fit that I rode down in. Cross winds are no problem at 70mph when tucked. I felt that the bike actually tended to turn into the wind somehow. The big ZG screen on the Ninja throws a bubble that the winds can use to move the bike to the side more. Or, the front of the Kawasaki got lighter with the bigger screen. It is more easily moved around by wind now but the quietness is worth it. I hope to get the CBR to this level even if I have to diy a windscreen.
Fuel injection is a big step up during cold start. It was 85*F today and the Ninja still needs a couple minutes of warm up before it will take any throttle even though I have adjusted the idle mixture. The Honda's engine felt slow for the first five minutes. Break in? or maybe the fuel injection computer needed to learn for the first time after the O2 sensor came on line so it could start building a map.
The Honda shifts much better. First gear is not as low people say. Speed at redline is somewhere around 24mph? although I usually shift right out of first at 10. 66mph is exactly 7000 so this rpm is a bit higher than other youtubes I have watched showing standing start to top speed pulls of the tach and speedo. Possibly because my odometer reads 1% LOWER than actual. Very rare in the bike world. I haven't verified the Ninja yet but it seems to be way off by almost 10% fast.
The Honda doesn't lug better at 3000 even though the torque curves show that it should. The single piston has a chugging feel when it lugs whereas the Ninja doesn't really buck as much but it just doesn't pull. The rear brake of the CBR is very weak but I don't use the rear much anyway. The front feels good on both bikes. There is zero vibration in the seat of the Honda. Very little in the pegs and the left grip is also almost dead. The throttle hand buzzes some but every rider will have some pain in the right hand on any bike unless it is equiped with some sort of throttle holding aid.
I really like the front running lights in the CBR and the fact that the front turn signals also stay lit up low for running lights. This always catches my attention more when I see a big touring bike come at me with four lights in the front. Maybe oncoming cars will quit turning left right in front of me. Perfect weather today. I rode off and on all day and into the evening to get a quick look at the lights. The Ninja's low beam is terrible. Should be illegal to put something like that on the road. I found a way to tip the high beam bulb back by bending one tab which lowers the vertical cut off so that bike's lights are more like two low beams now. Much better and I can leave the high beam on most of the time even if there is a car up the road in front of me. Shining the lights on a wall side by side, maybe the Honda is better? I didn't take it back out after dark as I was on the Ninja for that trip but I will.
More comments later I'm sure.
great write up thanks. Is there a lot more acceleration rush on the ninja and that's why you'll keep it as your fuel hog?
It's amazing how the crb250 cuts through the wind, I've noticed quite a bit, that relaxed riding in the tuck, the bike will just go forward while the wind pushes the wheels out. feels like it leans automatically.
The Honda has 21hp and can go to 23 with a slip on. The Ninja has 23 and can easily go up close to 30 with nothing more than air filter, pipes and jets. The ninja also has 3000 more rpm so there are power and gearing advantages. I'm sure there will be spec racing classes with the Honda which will give us the availability of some good parts but no modified CBR250R can race on the same track with a built up Ninja 250R. The higher revving, cammy twin just has a lot more potential to make power. On the other hand for fuel economy, the CBR is injected and the big single has 25% less piston crown surface area and 25% less combustion chamber roof area. So, much less heat energy loss. Look at the tiny radiator. It's cam is tuned to make it's power down low so less friction losses. The Honda will beat the Ninja on fuel economy.
I must say I do not understand the obsession with speed when comparing 250cc bikes. "After 80mph the Ninja will pull away and wave goodbye"
Are people riding 250 ninjas on the highways at 90mph pulling 15,000 RPMs? Is this a common practice?.. and if so, why? Who buys a 250cc street bike if speed is their concern?
The performance specs for both bikes are virtually identical. Since most people are never going to be be pushing their bikes to 15,000 RPMS.. I would suggest the CBR's power delivery is more suitable for most riders.
As far as the CBR versus Ninja 250 on a track? It all depends on the rider and the track. You can see tiny scooters beating 650 sport-bikes around the track, on you tube. It's hilarious to see a a 100cc scooter zipping by a 650 sport-bike, in the tight corners... The motorcycles look like they are standing still.
I must say I do not understand the obsession with speed when comparing 250cc bikes. "After 80mph the Ninja will pull away and wave goodbye"
Are people riding 250 ninjas on the highways at 90mph pulling 15,000 RPMs? Is this a common practice?.. and if so, why? Who buys a 250cc street bike if speed is their concern?
The performance specs for both bikes are virtually identical. Since most people are never going to be be pushing their bikes to 15,000 RPMS.. I would suggest the CBR's power delivery is more suitable for most riders.
As far as the CBR versus Ninja 250 on a track? It all depends on the rider and the track. You can see tiny scooters beating 650 sport-bikes around the track, on you tube. It's hilarious to see a a 100cc scooter zipping by a 650 sport-bike, in the tight corners... The motorcycles look like they are standing still.
I saw a write up of two ninja 250s and a wr motard going cross country. The guy said the wr just walked away from the ninjas on the hills.
I would like to see a 3 mile run, 0-1500 feet, cbr vs ninja. Would the cbr have any advantage on a long climb? The bike doesn't seem to have any problem getting me around with my gear. I can run with highway traffic through the hills easily.
It is tricky to get accurate fills one after the other I agree. The true fuel mileage will only be known by averageing several tanks in order to average out the slight differences of filling level. I try to eliminate as many variables as I can by pulling up to the same pump. Lean the bike on the kick stand the same way, and fill to the same place, just as the fuel can be seen to wet across the plate in the top of the tank. This last time I then refilled after taking my reading, while sitting on the bike and leveling it. I will try that for a few fills to see if I think it is more accurate to fill to the plate while level. This will eliminate any differences of lean of the kick stand. I do look like a geek though. Dribbling fuel in until it gets to an exact level.
After 1200 miles on the Honda CBR250R already, commuting, sport rides, and one 260 mile day, round trip to the world cup mountain bike race, I finally rode the Ninja 250 for my commute twice to compare. I feel that the new CBR250R is a much better sport touring bike. The seat is wider and flatter. It has more room to move around on. The Ninja seat tends to cram you into the tank. The tank of the Honda sits higher so is very comfortable to lay down on to get out of the wind and noise. It is also narrower so taller riders will have plenty of leg room whereas anyone over a 34" inseam will find their knees digging into the tank flair of the new gen Ninja. The Honda sits a little larger and higher all around. The rounder seat of the Kawasaki is easier to stand over for my 5'4" daughter though so shorter riders will prefer the Ninja. The fuel injected single warms up in 10 seconds, pulls harder around town and actually buzzes less on the highway and with a lower cruise rpm. The Honda's tiny radiator throws off less waste heat to cook you on hot days. Don't even mention fuel economy. Two near perfect runs the Ninja with a Zero Gravity Sport Touring windscreen only showed me 65.9 mpg US. Maybe switching to a Double Bubble wind screen would give back a couple more mpg. . Kawasaki Ninja 250R SE (Kawasaki Ninja 250R) | Fuelly . The Honda has been averaging 86 mpg US on my hypermiling commutes and still gets 70 mpg while doing a mix of errands and sport rides while the carburated Kawasaki will dip into the 50's on similar rides. . Honda CBR250R FI Single (Honda CBR250R) | Fuelly . The stock beam pattern of the CBR250R headlight is way more even and useful but the two bulb Ninja can be greatly improved by bending the top tab of the high beam bulb to make it into another and brighter low beam. I would rather have a really great low beam with 120 watts and no real high beam if forced to choose as we are. Whenever parked side by side, the Honda seems to draw all of the attention. Partly because it is brand new and people are already familiar with the Ninja, but also because the bodywork and nose are strikingly beautiful in the metallic red/ silver team colors. The CBR's nose has a big touring bike look to oncoming traffic with extra marker bulbs in the upper sides of the the headlight housing and because the front turn signals also stay lit as running lights. 20 pounds doesn't sound like a big diffence but the Honda feels lighter while yanking it around the parking lot and while riding. It is also less sharp edged over expansion joints. I haven't ridden anyone two up on either bike but one couple did 900 miles on a long weekend on the CBR250R so the rear seat must ride ok. I can say it is much better for supporting a Cortech trunk bag. I had to remove the rear seat on the Kawasaki as the bag had a tendency to fall over to one side or the other. The Ninja is obviously a great bike at a great price and fits my daughter perfectly. It will be fun to put the fuel injection kit on it to see how much the fuel economy can improve. My go to bike will be the CBR250R. I'm very glad I went through the trouble of tracking one down to buy. They are still very hard to find, especially if you want ABS which it is rumored will become standard equipment next year.
After riding my CBR for a month now, I'm more happy than ever that I chose it over the Ninja. I love the Ninjas and if I ever buy a larger displacement bike, it'll likely be a Ninja 650 but I couldn't be happier with the CBR.
Cool solar power. My brother has no wires hooked on to his house (or his road for that matter). He gets by with 900 watts from his panels. In Syracuse, NY USA!. Solar works. He has a large stack batteries to get up to 9.5KW/hrs as it is often cloudy for days on end here. He uses minimal consumption (1KW/hr per day) but it can also help quite a bit for a normal home and reduce the increasing burden on the transmission grid. I feel it should be code to have any new home construction face one roof pitch south and use rolls of soft film panels for roofing. Roofing shingles are crazy expensive anyway and the cost of the new soft roll panels would come way down if the scale of production were increased dramatically.
Hey just wanted to say thanks a bunch for posting this comparison. I am currently trying to decide between these two. Your review gave me a real unbiased comparison that I was looking for. I appreciate it alot.
Does the CBR250r have any advantage, power wise, doing mountain grades or pulling local hills, will the single's extra torque be any better for touring?
I wonder too, do you think the ninja is faster over long distance, say if you went 75 miles, would the ninja get you there faster, because of its power?
>you will take less breaks and be fresher on the CBR250R.
In my book that makes for a faster bike, I run along with traffic as well. From everything you've said, I think the cbr250r is a no brainer. I suspected all along the honda would ride wonderful and have good economy.
After reading your comments, I don't think I have to pick up a ninja, just to see for myself, it's probably a bit cramped for me. About the only check box for the ninja is that it is low tech, without a computer. I see some possible advantage in that.
I really am impressed with how smooth the cbr is and it has such a pleasing power band all over.
>I don't think I have to pick up a ninja, just to see for myself, it's probably a bit cramped for me. About the only check box for the ninja is that it is low tech, without a computer. I see some possible advantage in that.
As a race bike, the Ninja, with an exhaust, jets and intake, can hit 30hp. $700. Then the fuel economy will drop into the 40's when hammering. The Honda will need new cams to go with it's exhaust to make it to 30hp if any team racing program ever comes to be. 22hp of the stock CBR250R is plenty for me. I might try an exhaust to see if the fuel economy could get even better but am not real hungry for more power. The Honda is the better daily ride unless someone is too short to stand over it at which point the rounder seat of the Ninja would be easier.
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