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CBR250R Nearly Side-Swiped by Car

11K views 55 replies 10 participants last post by  pooder7 
#1 ·
#4 ·
I can't believe the rider noticed the car coming over and took his hand off the bar just in the nick of time.



I do think he was going too slow. When I ride on multi-lane highways (which I avoid most of the time) I usually try to be moving faster than the traffic so that I'm in control of lane positioning and distances.
 
#6 ·
i also prefer to find a car at my speed
then follow it, not too close, not center lane,
letting it cut thru air resistance somewhat
while using it as a partial shield..

i trail busses thru roundabouts etc, for same reasons,
drivers see/avoid driving into busses, while they seem
willing to take my roadspace and me..

they tend to be trained to be aware of
the roadside/end of road, so being closer to
roadsides helps enter their attention,
as road space they tend to avoid..

of course there are nutcases and others
in dreamland or even enjoying the power
of muscling in on bikes, scoots etc..
thus being relaxed but aware of approaching
/nearby cars is self evidently necessary..
 
#7 ·
This is absolutely terrifying. Exactly the reason I try to avoid larger highways if at all possible. Even at slower speeds though drivers really neglect bikers. I've had people pull out and almost T-bone me, had I not been paying attention. Usually, if there is a red light that we get stopped at I turn around and try to signal to the person that they almost ran into me, if they hadn't noticed, and they act like they were the ones in the right despite the fact that I had the right-of-way. It's absolutely ridiculous.

I once read a study on how when people are in their cars, they view all other vehicles as non-human (basically, they forget that there are people behind each and every other vehicle on the road). I would imagine that would be harder to attain with cyclists, as you can actually see the human form. Perhaps it is not this phenomenon occurring in the context of bikes, but rather the fact that people feel safe in their steel cocoons and are willing to be pushy to get where they're going faster. Who knows...

Moral of the story I would say is stay alert always.
 
#8 ·
I once read a study on how when people are in their cars, they view all other vehicles as non-human (basically, they forget that there are people behind each and every other vehicle on the road). I would imagine that would be harder to attain with cyclists, as you can actually see the human form. Perhaps it is not this phenomenon occurring in the context of bikes, but rather the fact that people feel safe in their steel cocoons and are willing to be pushy to get where they're going faster. Who knows...

Moral of the story I would say is stay alert always.
I always know there's someone behind the wheel of every car on the road; and they're all idiots trying to kill me. :frown2:
 
#9 ·
@lukethecoder

I noticed that I got cut off far more when I was riding without a high viz vest. I've been wearing one constantly while riding for about two years now and the number of incidents like has been significantly lower.

BTW highways are much safer for us than normal roads. That's because there are no intersections and everybody is going into the same direction, eliminating our number 1 enemy: The left turning car at an intersection.
 
#12 ·
I noticed that I got cut off far more when I was riding without a high viz vest. I've been wearing one constantly while riding for about two years now and the number of incidents like has been significantly lower.
Looks like I should invest in some high visibility gear then. It makes sense that it would decrease the number of incidents, as in many of the close calls I've experienced, it's as if the driver has just looked straight through me without even noticing me. I would say this is largely in part due to the high number of distractions drivers face/subject themselves to.

BTW highways are much safer for us than normal roads. That's because there are no intersections and everybody is going into the same direction, eliminating our number 1 enemy: The left turning car at an intersection.
That makes great sense as well. It's just a little more intimidating dealing with danger at 60+ mph speeds; you have less room for error.
 
#11 ·
agree with schroeder on intersections as hotspots
for serious smashes.. motorcycle crash video
compilations show this raw reality..

also todays stats for drivers sleeping at the wheel,
nodding off, sleep apnea, micro-sleeps, drowsy
driving [incl drug and alcohol effected]
are staggering..

especially on long monotonous
stretches of road or highway..

forewarned is forearmed tho..
we are different, in many ways..
riders rarely fall asleep while riding,
and it isnt, fair that the onus falls
on us, to ride defensively..

but its a price we must pay,,
along with the benefits of this
special single track vehicle..
 
#14 · (Edited)
Yikes! What was the driver thinking?

The only thing I would say the rider should have done is possibly noticed an erratic driver coming in his mirror or noticed a car unusually close (also in the mirror) as it was closing on him quickly.

That, and making a quick maneuver to the left of his lane to get more room. No matter who's fault, your absolute first priority needs to be getting yourself out of the way.
 
#15 ·
luke - 'less room for error' also means awareness of
your road environment.. almost invariably crashes
with heavy braking could have been avoided or
minimised by - extra braking distances -

also being ready.. 'ready' means about to move,
as opposed to having brain in auto pilot..
this what car drivers often do on long stretches..
'highway hypnosis' is an example of driving
automatically, but in a state where information
may not have access to brain areas responsible for
fast reactive responses..
sitting or slumping in a car seat, immobile,
sound dampened, no wind, that white line..

riders are not 'trapped' in one position however,,
and may easily do gently movements to almost
all body parts while riding..
even with gear and helmets there is wind,
wind and other external sounds..
instead of a leaden leg resting on the accelerator
we have our right hand attached to wrist then
elbow then shoulder joints,, all with specific
brain areas and all active, especially as we
reduce or increase speeds..

another reason for not 'becoming a car'
amongst cars,, rather remaining an independent
single track vehicle and rider, regardless..
those cars can bump into each other with no
or little effect,, which could take us down or out..

constantly scan mirrors, briefly.. it becomes almost
peripheral vision to notice a change behind,
a car coming up that wasnt there last glance..
this is good for your eye muscles and vision,
not something to be avoided..

think of riding with no brakes, in the wet..
ie, as if your brakes have failed..
thus use engine braking, only accelerating
enough to do the job, and leaving enough room
should you need to slow down or stop..
[very slow riding practice, feet on pegs,
is excellent,, including for distancing etc,
encouraging you to be aware of up ahead,
thus responding by slowing etc as needed]

we are, vulnerable..
but we do have specific advantages..
especially our size and minimal road space
requirements, together with mobility
within road spaces - choosing where
we want to ride.. consider this..
thus take advantage of our advantages..

it can be an interesting challenge,,
just riding safely, including slowly..
 
#21 ·
AMEN!

I try not to let anyone get close enough to do what the video showed. It is harder to prevent lane crossers from getting you when they are stationary or coming towards you.

So far, I've managed to avoid other vehicles, except for a car traveling parallel to me in the faster lane, that turned in front of me to get an angle parking space. This was back in the 1960's in Tuscaloosa, Alabama. I wound up with my left hand grip wedged in the passenger's door handle when we came to a stop. No damage to me or the bike, but it got a tad exciting.
 
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#22 ·
When I'm on a multi-lane highway / motorway, I try to move faster than traffic. I feel like that puts me in control of positioning and distance, rather than whoever is coming up behind me to overtake. My goal is thread through the wolf packs and try to find a clear space between pods of traffic. If someone wants to overtake and is moving at a high rate of speed, I stay well over and let them by.
 
#27 ·
agree on riding within clear space..
eg being filtering to the front at lights
so as to then take off into clear road space..
ie, 'motorcycle space'..

similar for higher speeds with potentially
wider space.. if a pack of them are taking up
a highway space they will all be on or above
the speed limit,, so i can sit back and watch them..

if/when they break up taking off ramps etc,
i will take best free space as it opens up..

i/we are limited with lower power, compared to
my last 750's which simply took what they wanted..
but the principle remains,, just a narrower range of
options.. if it means slowing, dropping back etc
to keep good clear space, then que sera..

in traffic situations such as thru shopping areas etc,
its the same principle within smaller spaces,
which then include escape routes/options
cars dont have,, any space a motorcycle can
fit into/thru is a mini-clear space..

in suburban type situations i will sit back from them
unless observing imo poor driving skills/erratic driving
thus dropping further back, waiting for a clear overtake,
them taking them out of my safe space..
we can overtake anything within a short distance
from normal low suburban speeds..

the overtake is also valid [as opposed to moving back]
in situations where another car is coming up behind,
so other than pulling over smartly to let him past
you want to take the suspect one ahead so as to not
be trapped between a poor driver and an unknown
up behind you... with less space or options...

best imo to leave 5 or 10 mins early, giving yourself
extra space - time space - less hurry, wider options..
when alone or distanced from cars, its pleasant to
simply enjoy the ride..
or for longer stints in the saddle
to pull over for a stretch...
 
#30 ·
its not just speed, but positioning..
there are better, safer places to be
than other higher risk places..

speed, can be any speed..
one of my pet practices is riding at speed
equivalent to slow walking pace..

also speed is [real world] relative,,
ie, 80kph filtering would be high speed,
whereas on the motorway [here 100kph]
it would be 20kph below typical speed..
there will be a range for traffic speed,
on motorways you can find someone
or a group at he speed you prefer..
then position yourself to best advantage,
using them as shields and visible objects
other car drivers brains notice and avoid, etc..

higher speed for a few seconds overtaking
can be a safety factor,, relative to staying
in bad positions, eg; near erratic drivers..

if any rider has any doubts about any
positioning maneuver, best listen to
that inner voice..
 
#31 ·
Should someone be in a position where speed in excess (over the speed limit) is "required" in order to rectify the situation, they placed themselves in an unsafe position to begin with. If this so happened to be the fast lane on the interstate, then they made the choice to be bottled in with those who exceed enforced speed limits and must deal with the choices of being in those situations.

If someone is doing 45 on an interstate, by all means pass them. But if they're doing the speed limit, and not behaving erratically, and you wish to pass anyway simply because "no one" behind you both will be doing the speed limit and that makes you uncomfortable, that is not a justification for excess speed to "rectify" a potentially hazardous situation, and said individual should simply use other tools at their disposal to remain out of harms way.

Forethought and anticipation is better than hindsight and improvisation.
 
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#32 ·
Should someone be in a position where speed in excess (over the speed limit) is "required" in order to rectify the situation, they placed themselves in an unsafe position to begin with. If this so happened to be the fast lane on the interstate, then they made the choice to be bottled in with those who exceed enforced speed limits and must deal with the choices of being in those situations.

If someone is doing 45 on an interstate, by all means pass them. But if they're doing the speed limit, and not behaving erratically, and you wish to pass anyway simply because "no one" behind you both will be doing the speed limit and that makes you uncomfortable, that is not a justification for excess speed to "rectify" a potentially hazardous situation, and said individual should simply use other tools at their disposal to remain out of harms way.

Forethought and anticipation is better than hindsight and improvisation.
I don't agree. There are unexpected situations when it's required for your safety to open up some distance, and sometimes that means accelerating. Slowing is not the only option, and can put you closer to a bad situation.

As far as not passing a car that's doing the speed limit - that depends. In some areas the "Speed Limit" is more of a suggestion, and traffic flow does not do the speed limit. In those situations, moving with the traffic flow - even if it's significantly over the limit - is safer than being consistently overtaken.

I lived in the Chicago Metro area for many years, and if you were doing the speed limit on major highways you were roadkill. I would routinely cruise at whatever speed put me in a opening with minimal overtaking and passing.
 
#33 · (Edited)
jkv357;651241[B said:
]In those situations, moving with the traffic flow -[/B] even if it's significantly over the limit - is safer than being consistently overtaken.
And there you're saying the same thing as cbrlocal. Go with the flow and don't constantly overtake by going faster than the already speeding traffic.

I lived in the Chicago Metro area for many years, and if you were doing the speed limit on major highways you were roadkill. I would routinely cruise at whatever speed put me in a opening with minimal overtaking and passing.
And here you're saying the same thing again. Go with the flow and avoid getting in bad positions. That doesn't require to be constantly faster than anyone else. I don't know about roads on the American continent, I've been at the US west coast in 2001 but wasn't really paying attention to traffic as I didn't drive myself there, but why are you toast when going slower than the speed limit on a multilane motorway? Over here semi trucks have a speed limit of 80km/h (~50mph) even on the speed limit free sections of the Autobahn and they don't get rear ended constantly when they overtake each other and have to go to the faster lane. In Germany you're supposed to drive on the right lane when not overtaking, you can stay on the center lane if you overtake trucks every now and then and you should only be on the fast left lane when you're really overtaking someone. This is known as the Rechtsfahrgebot (something like obligation to drive on the right hand side of the road). I can cruise behind a truck a 50mph on a Autobahn all day long if I want to. Hell, I can't even go faster than the traffic on the speed limit free parts on my 250 and still don't have a problem ....why is that so different in the US?:confused:
 
#34 ·
I can cruise behind a truck a 50mph on a Autobahn all day long if I want to. Hell, I can't even go faster than the traffic on the speed limit free parts on my 250 and still don't have a problem ....why is that so different in the US?:confused:
1. You don't want to ride behind a truck in the US. Your view ahead is completely blocked, you risk the sudden appearance of debris coming out from under the truck, and there's the risk of blown tires or retreads hitting you. If you leave more following distance, someone will squeeze in ahead of you. You will find yourself dropping back steadily, eventually hemmed in on all sides by traffic with no escape route.

2. We don't have Rechtsfahrgebot. We have Undiszipliniertes Fahren. People drive any speed in any lane they please, change lanes whenever they please (often without looking and without signaling), and drive at inconsistent speeds (I call it "binary throttle"...speed up/slow down/speed up/slow down). It is not uncommon to overtake someone going slower, only to find them tailgating you for mile after mile.

I just twist the throttle and escape the madness.
 
#38 ·
visiting my daughter in Freiburg Germany
i was impressed by the general civility
and control of drivers, and riders..
cars would make way for scoots, etc..

and yet, in the global context, roads and drivers
may be less than might be expected..

we have random breath tests for alcohol blood
content of drivers.. despite having some effects,
50% of all crashes on thursday,friday, and saturday
nights involve alcohol.. 30% of all fatal, drink drive
crashes, are on thursday, friday and saturday nights..

drunks often drive below the speed limit..
as do very old drivers and other incompetents..
it is by no means a valid choice to sit behind
cars driven slowly.. [just an eg, re speed]

in my experience here, while there must be
good drivers, you simply cant count on those
around you or nearby to be even competent,
let alone skilled or with good intent and sanity..

drivers do, occasionally, attempt to take out motorcycles..
drivers are a cross section of society, incl psychopaths etc..

so you cant, trust them.. at least generally, here..
thus the better option for experienced riders
is avoidance.. whatever rational form that takes..

laws, change.. here filtering was illegal..
then, overnight filtering became legal..
so i/we were right all along..
the law was wrong..
 
#41 ·
I've found that opening up distance behind and seeking open spaces ahead is a risk reduction strategy that puts me in control of my own destiny and does not place blind faith in the random elements of mankind on the highway.

When I was a new driver, my dad used to tell me to drive smart and not try to press a point of law with another driver because "You can be dead right." By which he meant, you may be technically and legally in the right...yet still get killed by the negligence of another.

On a motorcycle: when it comes to survival, I will always choose to flout the laws of men before I will try to flout the laws of physics, time, distance, and statistical probability.
 
#42 ·
Stopping distance and reaction time are all part of the laws of physics, time, distance, and the statistical probability you won't react in time when an incident arises. Riding is one gigantic balance of risk and decisions.

In my many years of riding, I've had no accidents (very fortunate) and have avoided many. 99% of those happened in front of me, and had I been traveling faster, things may not have ended as well. 75% of all motorcycle accidents involve either rider error or excessive speed.

I simply stand by my position from experience, the deaths of several friends, and highway statistics: If you find yourself using excessive speed to improve your situation, you're trading one death trap for another. I choose to avoid evil instead of picking between the lesser of two. >:)
 
#44 · (Edited)
This conversation reminded me of this viral video. A situation where using speed to solve an problem creates a bigger problem. The rider was riding aggressively initially (EDIT: rider was filtering through stopped traffic, which may not be legal in Florida), which upset an unusually aggressive driver.

He's lucky he didn't get killed.



You are much better to pull over as quickly as possible if ever confronted with something like this. I'm not advocating excessive speed to remove yourself from a situation, more like a short burst of acceleration to gain some space. Nothing like trying to "run away" from a threat.
 
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