[tollarja]

I'm trying to learn the twist of the wrist II technique of blipping the throttle while braking and downshifting, but I am having a hard time getting it. I got adjustable levers so I can move the lever closer, but I still can't get my fingers to slide over the lever while blipping without squeezing harder or softer and causing the bike to lurch. It seems like it would be too hard to slide my fingers while getting adequate braking.

Does anyone have any tips?

I'd also like to know how long it took you to master this technique on this bike. It seems the throttle response is a little sluggish, which was great while I was learning to ride, but sucks for this technique.

 

[mxracer56]

How many fingers are you using to pull the front brake? I use just one finger. For me I don't really think about it, I just do it. You are just going to have to keep trying different things till you find what works for you.

 

[r100]

I use 2 fingers on the brake lever (index + middle).
It's just practice.

 

[kflaig]

I''m like r100, a two finger guy.

I found that going to an aftermarket exhaust really helped me with this problem. The louder and clearer sound gave a much better idea of what the engine was doing when rapidly downshifting under braking, especially when going from 3rd to 2nd and from 2nd to 1st.

Maybe I'm getting deaf?

 

[Macca]

Dont slide your fingers then, drop your wrist and slide your palm.

guys only using2 fingers on this bike are not braking hard enough!

 

[Aufitt]

Yep just 2 finger progessive braking is all thats needed. thats why I like the standard lever. Pretty much all riding has 2 fingers at the ready.
The 'Blip' is a subtle wrist/palm action, (turning a doorknob), the elbow thould never move, and 2 fingers on the brake do not move.

 

[tollarja]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

I read two fingers is the way to go so that is what I use although I saw Valentino Rossi using all four fingers on the brake and blipping on a stock R6!

I've been trying to slide the fingers, but I'm going to try keeping them on the brake lever and move my hand. I feel like I am close, but this has been the most difficult thing to master so far...other than fast cornering and controlling my natural Survival Reactions, which I am nowhere close to mastering. I pogo while stopping, but it seems to be improving. I just need to commit to using the technique all the time and it may "work itself out." Since all you seem to be getting it to work on this bike I know it's possible.

What range of RPM's do you downshift in? I have been trying to keep it above 5,000 because that is where I feel the bike starts to have good acceleration, but it requires a larger blip.

Exhaust will be on the way once I buy a few other protective items. This might let the bike accelerate better in lower RPM's.

 

[Aufitt]

The blip is only the slightest palm movement, the 2 fingers stay in the same position in same plane to the elbow.

Alot of new riders death grip the bars far too much, then they complain of sore wrists or elbow pump and think they need differnt grips or different levers etc.

Bike drops about 1500 rpm between changes.. makes best power and response between 6-9000 so that is the operating rev range... but an akrapovic gets it so much quicker and responsive from about 5-9500.

 

[Cire 5th]

Blipping The Throttle

I am confused. I have read two different things about Blipping the throttle on a downshift. What is the right steps.

1. Clutch In
2. Blip Throttle
3. downshift
4. Clutch out

Let engine braking do the rest?

OR

1. Clutch In
2. Downshift
3. Blip Throttle
4. Clutch out

Let Engine braking do the rest?

I also read that Blipping throttle on the downshift is mostly down while your applying the front brakes with a two finger techique. But I just want to get the correct steps first.

Thanks in advance.

I usually do this when I downshift to proper gear to get back up to speed for example when the light turns green from red and I was slowing down:

1. Clutch In
2. Downshift
3. Blip Throttle (instead of blip though I just continously roll on the throttle)
4. Clutch out

 

[Metalstorm]

For me I think it's
clutch in
downshift and blip throttle simultaneously then release clutch.

Then again I've been doing this for years so I don't really think about what I'm doing, I think of what I want and the body takes care of the rest.

 

[tollarja]

I'm getting better...well at least to the point I'm confident I'm not hurting the engine. As expected the steps are starting to blur into each other.

While I was trying to figure it out I broke it down like this:
1. Clutch in
2. Downshift
3. Blip
4. Clutch out (slowly because I often didn't blip high enough)

Blipping high enough rpm wise would be a lot easier with a free reving engine. This one seems sluggish in the stock configuration. I need a quarter turn or more to get it to around 5,000 where I want it to be when I accelerate. It was hard to generate enough motion while maintaining consistent braking pressure.

Now that I have been getting it right more often:
1. Clutch in
2. Downshift/blip simultaneously
3. Clutch out

Next might be more like this:
1. Clutch in/Downshift/blip simultaneously
2. Clutch out


The whole idea of my original post is using this technique while braking hard. There is some engine braking, but the front brake should be doing the most work. The motorcycle is a lot clunkier and bouncier when the engine is doing too much braking.

I've been hesitant on the downshift because the transition from second to first makes a clunk that I can feel in the shift lever that is less perceptible if the final shift is below 10 mph. I know this is normal, but sometimes it doesn't sound great for the transmission. I really could use a gear indicator on this bike. A quick glance and I would know how many confident downshifts I can make if I forget what gear I'm in.

 

[Cire 5th]

For me I think it's
clutch in
downshift and blip throttle simultaneously then release clutch.

Then again I've been doing this for years so I don't really think about what I'm doing, I think of what I want and the body takes care of the rest.

Yea I can see now why its almost done simultaneously.

I was practicing it today whenever I would get to stops or when to slow down. I saw the benefits of it when dropping from 6th to 5th, 5th to 4th and 4th to 3rd but not from 3rd to 2nd. I would only brake before and after the shifting, not during, not yet anyway.

Before I really hit the road, I did a test on my local street here downshifting from 4th to 3rd without blipping and then I did it with blipping. Definetely smoother without any sudden lurching. I used to just wait till RPMs drop before downshifting. I can see why blipping would help you when you have no time to wait for the engine to drop to the proper RPM.

I also went out on the freeway for the first time so that I can take my bike up to 65-70mph. All I can say is WOW. Very smooth and little to no vibrations. On the freeway I didn't do no lane changes, i just stayed on the far right.

 

[Draekaar]

The blip is only the slightest palm movement, the 2 fingers stay in the same position in same plane to the elbow.

Alot of new riders death grip the bars far too much, then they complain of sore wrists or elbow pump and think they need differnt grips or different levers etc.

Wait what really? I've never had pain in my wrists or elbows... only been riding since september... I didn't realise braking was such a chore for some people! I just... brake. I've had to do a couple quick brakes and I've barely ever engaged the ABS... I don't really pay attention to what I've been doing but I think I just sorta drop it and pull in clutch at the same time then gentle/smooth braking instead of hard braking... *ponders* I've always done pretty gentle braking, not really interested in braking hard for a street light

Maybe it's just cause I took the safety course before ever riding my own bike? trained how to stop, over and over and over XD full 4 fingered brake, front and rear brakes engaged

 

[tollarja]

Wait what really? I've never had pain in my wrists or elbows... only been riding since september... I didn't realise braking was such a chore for some people! I just... brake. I've had to do a couple quick brakes and I've barely ever engaged the ABS... I don't really pay attention to what I've been doing but I think I just sorta drop it and pull in clutch at the same time then gentle/smooth braking instead of hard braking... *ponders* I've always done pretty gentle braking, not really interested in braking hard for a street light

Maybe it's just cause I took the safety course before ever riding my own bike? trained how to stop, over and over and over XD full 4 fingered brake, front and rear brakes engaged

We're talking about proper racing style downshifting while simultaneously braking so you are in the correct gear when you crack the throttle open again. This could come in handy on the road if you had to brake hard for some reason and then accelerate immediately because you are already in the proper gear.

 

[tollarja]

Well, I've been practicing for months and I just can't get it right. I recently got new suspension and it hid a lot of my choppiness, but as I get used to it I notice how poorly it's working for me. I don't seem to be able to rev it high enough (5,000+rpm) to shift into a usable range (4,500+rpm) for acceleration without extra pressure on the brakes causing dive and the revs drop below the gear speed and jolt the bike.

I decided to give my poor MC a rest and try a new technique of shifting and easing the clutch while braking. It just feels easier to modulate braking pressure this way. This is what came naturally for me as a beginner and if it's good enough for the dude in the Star school video it's good enough for me. I'll try again later, but for now it seems to be the way to go.

 

[Kurlon]

Try changing your hand position on the throttle. Most people use a snowmobile / atv style grip, arm perpendicular to the bars. Instead, grip 'sideways' like you're using a screwdriver, your arm will almost form an extension of the bar. This will require you to get closer to the bars, and will force your elbows out more. It's odd feeling at first, but you should notice that now instead of a lot of wrist motion you can roll the throttle from closed to WFO using your thumb and fingers. No heroics are required to get all the way to full open. This also allows a lighter grip.

This position should give you more finesse with the throttle and brake once you get used to it.

 

[tollarja]

Thanks Kurlon, I'll give it a try.

 

[Shmulik]

I fail to see how the thing you are doing is any different than a standard downshift.
If you don't adjust the revs the bike will suddenly decelerate when you downshift.

 

[tollarja]

The shift and release clutch is not different from what I think we all do when we first learn. I tried it again yesterday while braking and it did not upset the bike much at all.I was surprized at how smooth and fast I could do it. In a track situation, if you know you are coming up on a slow corner you could bang down a couple of gears quickly and ease clutch and brake. That is what a couple of videos of the clutch work of some pros looked like to me. They may have been cluthless downshift because it was fast.

 

[Kurlon]

I fail to see how the thing you are doing is any different than a standard downshift.
If you don't adjust the revs the bike will suddenly decelerate when you downshift.

It's exactly like a standard downshift, only you don't take 30 seconds to process each gear shift. The idea is to be able to use partial clutch to initiate the shift, a blip timed correctly to rev match, and no time spent feathering the clutch in, just drop and go.