Honda CBR 250 Forum banner

1241 - 1260 of 1281 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,343 Posts
I did not do the last oil change, or supervise the oil change. But I'll check it next time I go over there. Thanks!
Is your bike in a shop?

But yeah, when removing the filter, make sure the hole is towards the engine. A lot of people put them in with the hole in the filter towards the case which is incorrect and stops oil flow to the top end.

If a shop did your oil change, I'd sit there and watch them take it apart to see if its backwards yourself, because they will try to claim it wasn't so its not on them.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
6,948 Posts
Turns out the mapping did NOT solve the problem. It masked it and made it possible to drive the bike a little farther before terrible noises began. Teardown reveals a more catastrophic failure that was perhaps caused by failure of top end oiling? The camshafts wore away, not at the lobes but at the journals, until they moved far enough that the valve shims were able to come out, and then all hell broke loose in there. Metal swarf everywhere. So now the discussion is whether to source a salvage engine, or just part it?

I wish we had proceeded to the valve adjustment; we might have seen this sooner. :( If we had done a valve adjust when we were installing the Juice Box, we'd have seen the beginnings of this problem, and the answer then would have been like what others have talked about up-thread where their warranty jobs ended up installing new cylinder heads.

I now encourage anyone else with this problem, to open the valve cover and see what the status of the camshafts it.
Check out this thread: http://www.cbr250.net/forum/cbr250-problems-issues/49370-engine-quit-speed-3.html In post #21 you'll see that the cost for a new OEM cylinder head, camshafts, and other related parts isn't that expensive.

Definitely sounds like your engine top end had a lubrication problem, most likely caused by the oil filter being installed backwards.

Obviously performing the valve clearance inspection at the recommended intervals is important, but I doubt that was the cause of your top end failure. Over time & miles valve clearances become tighter, not loose.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
This is not my bike. It belongs to my (young adult) stepdaughter, who does not live with us. My husband did the last oil change and swears that he double triple checked that he was putting the filter in the right way, because he was highly aware of the potential for it going in backwards.

So after we put the Juice Box in, we gave the bike back to her. It suffered this catastrophic failure a few days later. She has put it in a shop that we all trust. The shop did the tear down. They report the oil filter was fine.

We have not yet decided what to do next.

And when you ride a Ural you get used to seeing swarf. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,226 Posts
has engine been opened before..
problem started with a previous oil change
which you repeated to ensure correct oil..
now its failed after another oil change,
with wear damage to journals [nature of which
should give some, hint as to causation]
which to the observer seems too much of a
coincidence to rule out the change..

whatever,, keep us posted on progress
:)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Husband has decided that you guys are correct and that he must have installed the oil filter backwards. Shop wasn't looking for that when they took it out, they were focused on checking for particles, not looking for an assembly error. Now that it's out, who can say which way it was in? We're going to call it a backwards oil filter and take it from there. My husband has told his daughter he owes her a bike!

Apologies for messing up this thread with what turns out to be an unrelated issue; I will butt out now. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,226 Posts
you never know,, my cb450 [dohc torsion bar valve springs] somehow
blocked an oil gallery causing cam etc damage..
so maybe hubby did install the filter correctly
and a gremlin got it..

the worst thing you can say to a child in a tree is
'come down, you'll fall!' reason being their brains
may respond to the strong command involving falling,
by falling out of the tree..

sounds illogical, but its not based on logic..

a similar thing can happen with assembling things,
where the thought 'dont put it in backwards'
can or might cause the 'put it in backwards' part
to become the action.. when the assembler is
basically confident, but not obsessive,
its more likely to happen, than for a novice
at the task who lacking confidence is more likely
to treat it as a 'new danger',, creating focus on
the action - like 'good' obsessive..

i actually do double check a popcorn bag in the microwave,
to make sure its in there correct side up, before pressing 'start'..

with the filter, somehow the spring seems to need extra care
and precision in fitting correctly, which is likely brain again
acting on my behalf in this minor, but essential placement..

as you mention, someone tearing it down wouldnt be
giving much attention to filter placement,,
being irrelevant to the task at hand..

plenty of times the obvious turns out to not be,
the real culprit.. at least youre not up for a new hp-4
or some other mega buck motorcycle...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
53 Posts
I just experience this last night again... Second time it has happened. It's been a while since the last event I can't remember when.

I just filling up with Non-Ethanol 89 Gas. I've only use Non Ethanol on this bike. The day before I also just did a oil change and re-lube my chain. :|

This time it had a hard time starting back up as well. It happened at night with no traffic thank god. Stuck at the light for a good 5 min or so pulled off the side to get it started. Turned key off/on, flip kill switch on/off, shift gears into neutral/1st and even rolled with the throttle when it was off. None of those help to get it started. Eventually it did.:|

I would hate this to happen during rush hour traffic. Also, my bike is about 9,000 miles and I daily ride it. :frown2:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
186 Posts
I just experience this last night again... Second time it has happened. It's been a while since the last event I can't remember when.

I just filling up with Non-Ethanol 89 Gas. I've only use Non Ethanol on this bike. The day before I also just did a oil change and re-lube my chain. :|

This time it had a hard time starting back up as well. It happened at night with no traffic thank god. Stuck at the light for a good 5 min or so pulled off the side to get it started. Turned key off/on, flip kill switch on/off, shift gears into neutral/1st and even rolled with the throttle when it was off. None of those help to get it started. Eventually it did.:|

I would hate this to happen during rush hour traffic. Also, my bike is about 9,000 miles and I daily ride it. :frown2:
Just did an oil change? Made sure the filter is the right way around?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
53 Posts
Just did an oil change? Made sure the filter is the right way around?
Yup, it is and it's filled up properly. Not too much, not too little. haha :grin2:
I'm also anal putting things back together I make sure the text that reads "Outside" upright if that makes sense. Oh, I use Honda Synthetic Oil if that helps too. haha
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
53 Posts
5 min to get it started? This is some other problem. If the bike stalls on closed throttle just due to the decel fuel shut off programming, it always restarts first try.
Really??? Hmmm, Because the First time it happened took some time as well during traffic at the light. Once the light turned green I manage to get it started. So, this second time I thought it was normal....

Also, to note this second time while coming to a stop I was weaving back and forth; left to right in my lane. Just being the normal me having fun. Does our bike come with a tilt sensor? Like if ever drop it'll shut off?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
53 Posts
Rode to work and just got home right now with no problems... She rides normal. 0:)
I commute everyday about 80 miles and which takes about 1 hour ride. Bike starts up everyday with no problems.

I'm not having problems like other people on here that says it happens mostly everyday.:confused:

Bike was bought with the exhaust and installed by the previous owner. I bought the bike with about 1,500 miles on February 25. He did do the proper break in and brought the bike into the dealership at 600 miles to do a valve clearance as recommended. I'm assuming exhaust install was done after the valve check. He owns a locally known dual sports shop so, I know it's well taken care of.

As far for a fuel controller I thought that was mandatory for full exhaust systems but, I'll look into it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
514 Posts
Really??? ...
Does our bike come with a tilt sensor? Like if ever drop it'll shut off?
Indeed it has a rollover tilt switch.
But the angle should be greater, as the max possible lean angle

To me this phenomenon looks a bit like the 'all day problems', some full auto scooter have here.

If older, the brake and side stand kill switch are misfunctional, every now and then.
Need a lot of moving, some minutes, sometimes
But the 250R (here) has only a kind of a kill switch, in case of trying to start with gear in but no clutch pulled.

I know other bikes, where I would check on the sidestand kill switch.
Has the 250 in the real world one like that?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,884 Posts
Fuel controller needed for full exhaust only. If it's just a slip on, it's fine without the controller. When I could tell mine was running lean from the exhaust, it was only at first start when it would stall, then start right back up the second fire and would stay running. This does not sound like that to me.

The shut off only happened to me once, and it never has again. You may have just caught the string of bad luck to have it happen to you twice in such a short time span. When mine stalled out approaching a stop light, it took about 30 seconds to restart, but not 5 minutes.
 
1241 - 1260 of 1281 Posts
Top