[Dallas93]

Hi everyone,

My 2012 CBR250R (ABS) has developed a new issue all of a sudden.

I went to start my bike yesterday morning but the battery was dead. The bike would not turn over at all, the lights were not working and the multi-function display was completely dead.

I bought a 1-Amp trickle charger, removed the battery and recharged it overnight.

When I reconnected the battery this morning, the radiator fan started running immediately, even though the bike was completely cold. It continued running when I started the bike. I also noticed that the coolant temperature gauge is blank.

The coolant level looks normal - right between min. and max. level when the bike is upright.

Has anyone else experienced this? If so, what was the issue?

If this can be fixed quite easily, I can carry out a basic repair myself but if it is something more complex, I will need to arrange a repair with my mechanic.

It may or may not be relevant but the weather in my area has been cold lately (approx. 2 degrees celsius or 35 farenheit).

Any advice would be much appreciated!

Thanks

 

[Tamir]

I bought a 1-Amp trickle charger, removed the battery and recharged it overnight.

The charging instructions for the battery are 0.6A for a maximum of 5 hours, charging 1A for the whole night is more than double, even if before charging the battery was fine, there is a chance that it is now burnt.
You can chack it with voltmeter:

• If it does not hold 12.7V after charging, it is bad battery.
• If it does not hold at least 10V during an electric start, then it is also bad battery.
• Besides, check charging, when the engine is running there should be a voltage higher than 13.2V on the battery terminals, if not then the charging system is bad.

 

[Tamir]

When I reconnected the battery this morning, the radiator fan started running immediately, even though the bike was completely cold.

According to the wiring diagrams , if I'm not mistaken, the fan gets a fixed minus directly from the frame, and a plus from the relay. The relay receives plus directly from the battery (On the way there is the fan fuse - fuse number 4). So if the fan relay is stuck in closed position (N.O. Normal Open), then the fan can work even when the whole system is off. If this is what happened to you then replace the fan relay.

 

[Dallas93]

The charging instructions for the battery are 0.6A for a maximum of 5 hours, charging 1A for the whole night is more than double, even if before charging the battery was fine, there is a chance that it is now burnt.
You can chack it with voltmeter:

• If it does not hold 12.7V after charging, it is bad battery.
• If it does not hold at least 10V during an electric start, then it is also bad battery.
• Besides, check charging, when the engine is running there should be a voltage higher than 13.2V on the battery terminals, if not then the charging system is bad.

Thanks for your answer but I used an intelligent battery charger which stops charging the battery when charging is complete to prevent overcharging.

 

[Tamir]

If this can be fixed quite easily, I can carry out a basic repair myself but if it is something more complex, I will need to arrange a repair with my mechanic.

Easy or hard job? It's only you can decide.
Access to the relay is easy, you have to removed the main side cover on the left.
To pull the relay out of its place may require some force, there is no way to hold it by hand properly, you may need the help of pliers, but work wisely so as not to break anything.

 

[Dallas93]

The charging instructions for the battery are 0.6A for a maximum of 5 hours, charging 1A for the whole night is more than double, even if before charging the battery was fine, there is a chance that it is now burnt.
You can chack it with voltmeter:

• If it does not hold 12.7V after charging, it is bad battery.
• If it does not hold at least 10V during an electric start, then it is also bad battery.
• Besides, check charging, when the engine is running there should be a voltage higher than 13.2V on the battery terminals, if not then the charging system is bad.

Thanks but I used an intelligent battery charger which stops charging the battery when charging is complete to prevent overcharging.

According to the wiring diagrams , if I'm not mistaken, the fan gets a fixed minus directly from the frame, and a plus from the relay. The relay receives plus directly from the battery (On the way there is the fan fuse - fuse number 4). So if the fan relay is stuck in closed position (N.O. Normal Open), then the fan can work even when the whole system is off. If this is what happened to you then replace the fan relay.

Thank you. This is helpful. I will have to get hold of a multimeter to check the fan relay.

 

[TrueFaith]

I always use the principal of Occam's Razor in diagnosing a problem. Since the only thing you did differently was remove and recharge the battery, you should exhaust any possibility that the battery is bad or undercharged before you start pulling relays. Get that multimeter but use it to insure that your battery is 100% before you use it to check anything else. The chances of a relay going bad is much more remote than having a bad battery, especially if it's the original one in your 2012. Just because you get a green light on your battery tender doesn't mean it's actually holding that charge. You need to confirm that you have a good battery before you do anything else.

 

[Dallas93]

I always use the principal of Occam's Razor in diagnosing a problem. Since the only thing you did differently was remove and recharge the battery, you should exhaust any possibility that the battery is bad or undercharged before you start pulling relays. Get that multimeter but use it to insure that your battery is 100% before you use it to check anything else. The chances of a relay going bad is much more remote than having a bad battery, especially if it's the original one in your 2012. Just because you get a green light on your battery tender doesn't mean it's actually holding that charge. You need to confirm that you have a good battery before you do anything else.

This is good advice - thank you. I will pick up a basic multimeter later so I will use that to test the battery first. I will let you guys know how that goes!

 

[Tamir]

You need to confirm that you have a good battery

TrueFaith is right to insist👍
Dallas93 If after charging your motorcycle starting well, then why you need to check the battery?
Mmmm...You don't.
Well, if after charging you manage to start normally, it means that the battery is strong enough.
Mmmm...
You may find yourself in the situation of a normal test
for a battery that is far from be healthy.
And I explain:

You may be met with the following dilemma​

A complete discharge of a battery causes significant damage to the battery. The damage will be discovered during the tests volt, BUT maybe you will find that the test is OK(NOW), and you will find out later that its lifespan has been significantly shortened. No one wants to get stuck because of a bad battery. On the other hand, the battery it's an expensive component (relatively), so why to buy NEW if all tests came out fine?

I will pick up a basic multimeter later so I will use that to test the battery first.

YES
BUT Remember:
You will do the tests, and you may face the dilemma I mentioned above,
only you decide what to do.

 

[Dallas93]

Update: I bought the multimeter and the battery seems to be OK

12.61v when the ignition and engine are off

14.32v when the engine is idling

I have moved the bike into a small garage at the side of my house where the temperature is probably around 10 degrees Celsius (50 Fahrenheit) and so far no issue.

I am not sure what is going on. Is this issue possibly caused by cold weather? It still isn’t normal obviously but it might help to narrow down the issue to the thermostat maybe?

Any ideas guys!?

 

[Tamir]

12.61v when the ignition and engine are off
14.32v when the engine is idling

Good. You still missing one volt test:

• If it does not hold at least 10V during an electric start, then it is also bad battery.

I have moved the bike into a small garage ...and so far no issue.

It is possible that the relay has released and jumped back into normal place (Normal.Open.), it could be related to extreme temperatures. Maybe you should replace the relay to remove the doubt (this is a repair that is considered easy job, and also cheap one).

It still isn’t normal obviously

Explain, what is not normal? Did the fan work again without stopping?
Problems that come and go are difficult to locate, and sometimes there is no choice but to wait, then when the situation worsens the source of the problem becomes clear and obvious.
I recommend to replacing the relay.

 

[Dallas93]

If it does not hold at least 10V during an electric start, then it is also bad battery.

OK thanks I will check this later.

Explain, what is not normal? Did the fan work again without stopping

If the cold weather is triggering the fan to turn on when the bike is cold, then that is not normal.

I recommend to replacing the relay.

OK I will see if the problem occurs again in the coming days.

 

[Tamir]

If the cold weather is triggering the fan to turn on when the bike is cold, then that is not normal.

YES this would not happen with a good component, it is possible that it is stuck and temperature differences cause the small gap that still remains to close.
So I said, replace the relay

OK I will see if the problem occurs again in the coming days.

The best is to replace.
When we repair at the mechanic, some of us have the feeling that sometimes the mechanic just changes parts to make more money (which of course is not true).
When we repair on our own (DIY), the responsibility to replace is on us, and then there is a temptation not to replace to save work time and money(and this is obviously not true either).
It is what it is.

 

[jkv357]

Is there a temperature sending unit on the radiator?

If so, I would also expect that it could be faulty and be showing a false hot condition.

 

[Dallas93]

Is there a temperature sending unit on the radiator?

If so, I would also expect that it could be faulty and be showing a false hot condition.

Yes there is a thermostat that measures the coolant temperature. Possibly faulty, as you say.

The problem has not recurred in the last few days so I will hold off before I attempt any repairs.

 

[Tamir]

Is there a temperature sending unit on the radiator?

If so, I would also expect that it could be faulty and be showing a false hot condition.

NO, not on the radiatoer.

In our model, the heat sensor is in the engine block (the sensor is in the cylinder at the back, the cylinder has the coolant channels).
In our model there is already a computer (ECM), and the heat control circuit goes through ECM. The heat sensor sends a signal to the ECM, and the ECM, as needed, sends a signal to the fan relay.

But there is another mode that allows our CBR fan to work even though the system is turned off, including the computer that is turned off.
And it happens when the fan relay stuck in CLOSE position even though there is no longer voltage on the solenoid that activates it (The relay is a standard Normal Open).
So I argued that the relay should be replaced.

Yes there is a thermostat that measures the coolant temperature. Possibly faulty, as you say.

Possibly BUT NOT likely.
The heat sensor can be checked separately, but right now, when your problem appears when the main switch is off, then as I explained, the fan relay needs to be replaced.

 

[Dallas93]

I have an update guys:

I fully charged the battery again with the smart charger, then got the multimeter out to test the voltage when cranking the engine.

First start: around 10 volts

Started it another 5 or 6 times, and each time the voltage was only around 7/8/9 volts.

So looks like we have a busted battery! Will replace it tomorrow and let you know how that goes.

 

[Tamir]

I have an update guys:

I fully charged the battery again with the smart charger, then got the multimeter out to test the voltage when cranking the engine.

First start: around 10 volts

Started it another 5 or 6 times, and each time the voltage was only around 7/8/9 volts.

So looks like we have a busted battery! Will replace it tomorrow and let you know how that goes.

Just pay attention to the malfunction with the fan, the one that caused the battery to fail, note that it does not repeat itself. If necessary, then disconnect the connector of the fan, or take the fan relay out. I think you need to replace the fan relay