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So what do you think? Is Sarge right, or off his rocker?

  • Sarge is spot on! Leave the stock exhaust alone!

    Votes: 134 47.5%
  • Sarge is full of crap! Aftermarket is better, so go for it!

    Votes: 148 52.5%
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Discussion Starter #1
For those of you that have yet to change the exhaust, I am going to throw my two cents in on the subject in this thread.


  • Our bikes are 250cc. They produce 23 hp or so, from what I have read. You risk turning your bike into a POS that backfires, produces too much noise, gets worse gas mileage, etc. all for perhaps a tiny tiny gain when you mess with the exhaust. Or, even worse, you get all of the above with no measurable gain.
  • Honda designers engineered a very suitable exhaust system for this bike.
  • Exhaust is more than just "opening it up so it can breathe." If this were not the case then the best exhaust mod would be to hack the thing off and leave it open.
  • Exhaust scavenging improves engine efficiency, and scavenging comes from an ideal amount of exhaust restriction.
  • Look at all the threads on this site about making aftermarket exhaust quieter. Most aftermarket exhausts, I will venture to say, add more NOISE increase than Horsepower.
  • A loud exhaust does not make you safer, only more obnoxious. At moderate to higher speeds people behind you (i.e. those that see you) may hear you better... those in front, they still can't hear you.
  • You may want to sell your bike someday. You may have to spend money to get it back to bone stock in order to entice a buyer willing to pay top dollar, or else you may have to sell it at a discount because its got a stupid fart can on the side of it. Many people looking at used bikes, myself included, would look at an aftermarket exhaust on this bike and think it is a big red flag not to buy the used bike in question. Save the money you'd spend on this exhaust and put it toward your next bike, if you aspire to a more powerful bike.
  • Stock exhaust weighs 40 pounds? Okay, I will take peoples word for it that they weighed it on a scale. Aftermarket exhaust weighs 10 pounds? Okay, so the weight savings is 30 pounds. Why not just exercise more, get healthier yourself, and lose that 30 pounds from your belly instead of changing your exhaust? Put the $500 you'd spend on the exhaust towards weight watchers.
Leave the exhaust alone! You are making your bike look stupid, you are wasting money, and it is only a 250cc after all. It is not a Corvette. The only people that benefit when you upgrade your exhaust are the shareholders in the company that manufactured the exhaust and the website that sold it. The people that are losing out are, you, your family, your neighbors for having to listen to your stupid 250cc roaring like a rocket ship, your riding buddies, anyone that sees you on the street, your bike's next owner, yada yada yada...


Discuss.
 

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So, what STUPID bike do you ride? Is where I say "Yes sir! How high sir!" You're entititled to your opinion. You cld be nice about it though
 

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Not everyone who installs an after market exhaust is after increased hp, OR for safety reasons. Some make the change strictly for cosmetic reasons and choice. If I was after a performance machine I wld not have bought the single cylinder 250. Speaking for myself, I'm having fun while learning more about my bike. It's my hobby and sport. If it is your choice to hang onto a hideous looking pipe, then by all means do so. Your target audience may be ones who have yet to change the pipe, but you still manged to be insulting towards those who already have. Express yourself, it is encouraged on this forum, just don't be rude about it.

BTW, if I havn't welcomed you to the forum yet....welcome:D
 

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[*]Stock exhaust weighs 40 pounds? Okay, I will take peoples word for it that they weighed it on a scale. Aftermarket exhaust weighs 10 pounds? Okay, so the weight savings is 30 pounds. Why not just exercise more, get healthier yourself, and lose that 30 pounds from your belly instead of changing your exhaust? Put the $500 you'd spend on the exhaust towards weight watchers.
Much at issue with your post, but just thought I'd address this one. The stock exhaust is 18.6 lbs. An aftermarket setup might be 6, but the real problem here is this hokey idea that the rider should lose weight.

Weight weenies in road cycling hear this bull all the time from newbies, cheapskates and non-cyclists about how insane it is to spend thousands on a bike that weighs 16 lbs. when you could spend a few hundred on a 20 lb. bike and skip dessert. If you ride them back to back that 4 pounds feels like 34.

Also, I'll see your "exhaust scavenging" and raise you "pumping losses". Properly designed open exhausts are getting higher power readings across the board, so there's no such problem.

There are two main problems with exhaust systems for this bike:
1) Many are clearly too loud.
2) The catalyst is in the OEM muffler.

My exhaust is still stock. Your audience has spoken.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
@ live to ride: Guilty as charged.

Sorry everyone, wasn't intended to be rude.

As I re-read my post, it sounds pretty crumudgeony, but if it helps, I had a smile on my face the whole time I was typing it...:):):)

I apologize if it sounds like I am heaping scorn on those that have already upgraded their exhaust... I really wanted to present the "alternative argument" for the benefit of those on the fence on this decision.

I have read many threads about exhaust on this forum, and I can't recall a single one where someone brought up the notion that perhaps, on our bike, the best choice is the stock exhaust. And I do realize that is my OPINION...

Sorry if it sounded like I was trying to be rude...

Really, I just was hoping to state what I consider to be the valid argument against messing with our bike's exhaust. :cool:
 

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Apology accepted Sarge. There has been threads on keeping the stock exhaust. Generally by riders who have a mechanical back ground and "know better". I speak for myself and not for others. I chose an aftermarket exhaust as I cld not stand the stock. I gagged every time I looked at it. I have also noticed some gains with the full exhaust and Bazzaz on the lower end albeit small. I don't care as I do not plan on racing this machine.
 
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To each is own... Most of what you said makes sense in my mind. However, the only thing I didn't like about the bike is how the exhaust looked so I did put an aftermarket on strictly based on that. The noise is obviously louder but I don't mind it, if I was worried about what other people thought about what I do I probably wouldn't do most of things I do.

Also, this bike is a 250cc but that doesn't mean it isn't quick and that it shouldn't sound as such which the stock exhaust doesn't provide for me. Ive had the yoshimura TRC on for about 2 months now and I have yet to get one complaint or negative opinion about it from anyone including my family, friends, and neighbors.

As far as price goes, you can get a lot of slip ons for quite cheap ($150-$200) or even cheaper. It seemed like a great investment being that I plan on keeping the bike for a long time because it is great on gas and very economical, especially being that I use it as a commuter here in texas.

Moving on to the weight thing... Jeez dude, I know where your coming from but to tell people to lose that much weight is a bit farfetched. Im guessing that you being in the marines has something to do with your view on it. I actually couldn't agree with you more in some ways being that Im in the Army myself. The only problem is that you don't see too many 200 lb + guys riding a 250cc for exactly that reason, its a small bike! Im 6ft 175 lbs (Not really any weight to lose) and surprisingly, I felt that the bike picked up quicker after the exhaust swap. Needless to say, I couldn't be happier with my after market exhaust and I would do it again if I had the chance to.

To hit on the efficiency, generally, I haven't noticed a drop in the MPG's / efficiency since the swap. I will monitor the MPG's closely over the next month or two and see but I doubt there is any considerable loss.
 

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I don't understand why anyone would care what other people do with their bikes. Thank God it's still a country where we have the choice to pretty much do as we wish.

Edit: I'll just say that I have the stock exhaust on my CBR and have no intention of changing it but if I did why would it matter to anyone?
 

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I kept the stock exhaust because I don't like listening to the noise of loud pipes the entire time I'm riding. It may sound novel to hear them when a bike passes by, but it got annoying after a few hundred miles on my last one. Also, after removing the baffles I lost a noticeable amount of low end power, so back in they went. Personally, sound is not something I get excited about anymore. I'd make my bike completely silent if I could, and the stock mufflers are closer than anything else out there.
 

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I'm thinking about changing the exhaust, but I think Sarge has some valid points. That said, I HAD to vote for the aftermarket because of the "Sarge is full of crap" choice. ROFL I crack myself up
 

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I still have the stockers, but I'm looking to upgrade to a smaller, lighter, more roomy one for several reasons. The most pressing one is that the stocker already left burn marks on my saddlebags. Less pressing is that I'm going to start tracking this bike pretty soon, and I want something that is lighter and doesn't look like it a melon shooter. The one below looks interesting and is the one I'm leaning towards, no pun intended.

 

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I have always said and will say again..I am one of the few that find the stock exhaust compliments the bike well...and from all the looks, thumbs up and accolades on the bikes appearance I have gotten..I would hardly describe it as unsightly or ugly, much less "hideous"..

I think you hit the nail on the head Sarge...I agree with every word in your post...but thats me personally
 

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Everyone is free to have their opinions. Part of the issue with this thread is text can't properly convey the meaning/feeling behind the OP's post. Text is very easy to take out of context and misconstrue what was meant. Sarge has already admitted that his intention was not to insult, merely to voice his thoughts and opinion so can we cease the bashing please? Or did I manage to take posts out of context as well and now you are just razzing him for fun (like friends do). And for the record my exhaust is stock for the time being but I've already ordered an aftermarket slip on (researched what sounded good (to me) without being rediculously loud).

Sent from my Milestone X using Motorcycle.com Free App
 

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Dang it!... I just ordered an FMF Apex Carbon Fiber slip on for my scoot, literally a half an hour before Sarge put up this thread. Too late now, I'm just going to have to live with my foolhardy decision. Seriously though, I'm looking forward to getting that trick looking piece of eye candy on my bike. That it weighs 3.6 lbs., instead of 18.6 lbs. is significant. I have FMF exhausts on my XR's for the same reason... they are much lighter than the stock exhausts. As far as resale value goes, I'm one of those guys who has learned his lesson selling bikes that I should have kept. My garage has a nice selection of Honda motorcycles now, and I wouldn't sell any of them. Still have all the stock exhausts though. I can't imagine that anyone who has installed an aftermarket exhaust, would have just thrown away their stock muffler, so putting the bike back to stock is a non-issue if the owner does decide to sell the bike.
 

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I'm thinking about changing the exhaust, but I think Sarge has some valid points. That said, I HAD to vote for the aftermarket because of the "Sarge is full of crap" choice. ROFL I crack myself up
I'm fence sitting as well -- Still debating do I keep it OEM or do I get a Hindle. I honestly don't mind the look of our stock exhaust and kinda like the sound above 8000rpm, but below that it just sounds kinda dull and if I can save some weight/get slightly better pickup then those are big pros to me as well (but I'm not sure yet they are $400 big pros for a $5000 bike lol).
 

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I'd be willing to change to an aftermarket IF a manufacturer makes one that doesn't sound obnoxious and is not deafening loud. As youtube videos don't do much justice for the sound that the current aftermarket exhausts make though all I'm really going off of is other peoples' opinions...some people say Jardine is obnoxious others don't...unless there's a clear majority consensus on an aftermarket exhaust that's quietish and makes gains, however small, I'm staying stock. Moneys better spent at this point fixing the squishy front end.
 

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I've been tempted too but until I know I'm keeping this bike forever, even if I do buy another bike, I think I am staying stock for many of the reasons Sarge espoused. I thought it was clear you were just starting some discussion Sarge. I wouldn't mind less weight and more growl but the pros to keeping it stock outweighs the cons right now in my mind for the current situation. I have yet to hear any aftermarket in person on the 250 and I wouldn't be surprised if that quickly changed my mind though.
 

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I like that the bike is quiet and doesn't annoy my neighbors...but I think the factory pipe is quite ugly -- they might as well have added a nice hearth and brick flower pot to it. If I could gain some hp I'd be all for changing it but that doesn't seem to be the case.
 
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